Plans to remove yet more parking in Charlbury- Market St

Wed 7 Jan 2015, 16:50

When M/S Gray first came to Charlbury, I said to her that I hoped she would be happy here, now that she has persuaded her architect to revise her plans in the light of public opinion,I would like to thank her and reiterate that I hope she and her family will be very happy here.

Wed 7 Jan 2015, 14:22

The applicant has submitted revised plans in which proposed access from Market Street has been removed. The new plan has not yet been uploaded onto the WODC website, but I have requested that the application is reviewed by the planning committee, as there have been other issues raised In the comments received by the council.

Wed 7 Jan 2015, 11:52

None of the postings below are spiteful, personal or instrusive. A planning applicationhas been submitted for public comment, and large numbers of people have exercised their democratic right to object to it.

Wed 7 Jan 2015, 10:44

We all know that Parking is a real problem all around charlbury but I cannot believe that personal, intrusive and somewhat spiteful comments are in any way relevant to the subject. What a terrible welcome to charlbury

Sat 3 Jan 2015, 20:45

Cheryl Morley will be out of office. So instead send your comments/objections to planning@westoxon.gov.uk

Sat 3 Jan 2015, 17:28

Emails to Cheryl Morley elicit this automatic response. It may be best to send any emails to both addresses.

"Unfortunately I am out of the office until Monday 5th January. If you are sending a letter of representation in regards to a current application please forward your message to planning@westoxon.gov.ukmailto:planning@westoxon.gov.uk or call 01993 861420. I apologise for any inconvenience this may cause. Thank you."

Sat 3 Jan 2015, 14:37

I've just been told that you can e-mail any comments directly to the planning officer who is cheryl.morley@westoxon.gov.uk quoting reference 14/01589/HHD.

Sat 3 Jan 2015, 14:26

Same here.

The link in Susan Way's post goes to nowhere as does any link from the WODC site to Planning section.
They like to make it difficult, don't they.

Sat 3 Jan 2015, 13:24

I can't access the application to comment, either using this URL or the planning links in the WODC main site. Has anyone else found this?

If the site is malfunctioning, will WODC extend the 5th Jan deadline for comment?

Mon 29 Dec 2014, 10:36

Comments can be made online before the next planning meeting which is 5 January 2015. The revised plan is available here - publicaccess.westoxon.gov.uk/online-applications/applicationDetails.do?activeTab=documents&keyVal=NE21LURKFPD00

Wed 24 Dec 2014, 13:37 (last edited on Wed 24 Dec 2014, 13:46)

Thank you Elaine for posting details of the revised plan. My understanding of Planning is that comments / objections have to be made on the latest plan issued. As such, I have submitted an objection to the revised plan as it still includes the removal of much needed on-street public parking space in Market Street.

Sun 21 Dec 2014, 00:32

Thank you, Elaine, for drawing our attention to this. So far as I can see the amended application would still result in the loss of a parking space from Market Street, and on that basis I have again objected to it. As several of the objectors have said, there are clearly two viable alternative options (the existing access from Church Street, or trying to negotiate some sort of access via the entrance to Chelwood). The parking situation in central Charlbury is currently so desperate that I can see no reason why the community at large should lose even one space in these particular circumstances.

Sat 20 Dec 2014, 13:43

Amended Layout Plan now on WODC website amended on the 19th Dec

Mon 15 Dec 2014, 09:14

When the yellow lines were first introduced, we were told that to have time limited parking, there has to be a full time traffic warden, of course that may have changed.

Sun 14 Dec 2014, 22:56

It doesn't sound very fair to me that an incomer or anyone else for that matter could cause the loss of these valuable public parking spaces. Maybe Charlbury needs more time limited parking? with a residents' parking permit scheme for on-road parking and a heavy premium for second and subsequent vehicles.

Fri 5 Dec 2014, 11:06

My thoughts exactly Tony. The proposal has been put up for public comment and requires objective, rather than subjective, responses.

Thu 4 Dec 2014, 15:07 (last edited on Thu 4 Dec 2014, 16:18)

Surely the key point is that a house that has a perfectly suitable access for cars wishes to create another unsuitable one at the expense of public spaces, which are needed in the centre of Charlbury
This is not a personal attack on someone new moving here or an over reaction, merely a logical statement that the current access should be utilised rather than affecting public spaces

Thu 4 Dec 2014, 14:31

This is my wild guess only but I think about 99% of people around the world wouldn't mind to have these kind of problems!!! On the other hand, I could be wrong. Welcome to Charlbury Danuta;-)

Wed 3 Dec 2014, 10:51

Why not a covered walkway instead of a glass link

Tue 2 Dec 2014, 11:30

When the new disabled space was introduced outside the Pharmacy I enquired of the Highways dept whether there was a possibility of removing any of the yellow lines to free up more parking but was told there was no scope to do so anywhere along Market Street due to the requirement for turning in and out of driveways and alleys along the street, and also to allow enough angle to turn into the street from Church Street and Browns Lane. So that is not an option either.

Mon 1 Dec 2014, 20:49

Well said Judith, I think you have said what a lot of others may had been thinking. Mrs Gray must have wondered if Charlbury was going to be welcoming after looking at the trail of comments.

Sun 30 Nov 2014, 18:24

Well said Leah

Sun 30 Nov 2014, 17:08

Well said, Judith.

Sun 30 Nov 2014, 12:54

There is masses of parking at the back of Albright House, without encroaching on the public Highway

Sun 30 Nov 2014, 11:21

I would just like to say I feel sorry for this family who are about to move to Charlbury, being faced with this barrage of criticism. Not a very welcoming start to life here! While I can see the difficulties with parking, I think it is totally inappropriate to be criticising people's lifestyle in this way, as some people have done! In this day and age, with adult offspring living at home, it is not unusual to have a four car family!

Wed 26 Nov 2014, 18:56

you could gain spaces by just removing the yellow for rose and crown to the disabled park plenty of room there.

Wed 26 Nov 2014, 17:03

The yellow lines opposite the Post Office are vital to allow vehicles to turn out of the driveway to the side, they do have an important purpose. we have had to contact the police on numerous occasions to try and have a car removed. I am not talking about someone parking for a short period of time to use the local facilities but overnight and longer ! Impossible to turn in a larger vehicle !

Wed 26 Nov 2014, 16:29

Why not try and get the yellow lines removed on the pharmacy side you would gain more spaces than all this arguing, trying to change the way people live,is not the way to go, there is parking problems all over Charlbury, Market St being one of them the yellows don't seem to be doing anything to help!!

Wed 26 Nov 2014, 00:18

I just wanted to thank those who drew the attention of the community at large to this application - and to express my surprise and dismay that (as noted, I understand, at the Town Council planning committee on Monday evening) that the only public notice about it was in Church Street, and that no notice was posted in Market Street, the area of the town most affected, and where there were the most objections.

Tue 25 Nov 2014, 08:53

Previous Post ??

Tue 25 Nov 2014, 08:24 (last edited on Tue 25 Nov 2014, 08:24)

I refer to my previous post!

Mon 24 Nov 2014, 23:11

I think the answer to Ms Gray's parking problem is perhaps not too difficult to find. Surely she should forget the idea of a new access route via Market Street and instead base her plans on the existing vehicle access point, i.e. through the front of Albright House on Church Street.

It might mean that Ms Gray has to compromise on less floor space in the re-developed house but her family would still get their private parking, Charlbury would not loose those valuable on-street parking spaces, she would make friends and the architects would not loose respects. It would be a challenge but let's hope that Ms Gray and local architects McCormick Smith can rise to it.

Mon 24 Nov 2014, 22:08

Indeed, lenght if time of living in Charlbury is in itself inconsequential. But arriving new does not excuse house owners from trying to understand the local situation. I think the clear objection here is not so much arriving in the center of town as a four-car (!) household, but the fact that the planning proposal suggests that it would be okay to sacrifice three *public* parking spaces (i.e. available for any road user, even if not a Charlbury resident) for access to private parking for all these cars. The only way this could be acceptable would be of the parking they created would be public, but the whole point is that they want their own 'guaranteed', private parking, a luxury very few residents of the center of Charlbury have. Others, including library and pharmacy users, would have to keep on gampling on availabitily of a public space, which will become harder due to the removal of three of the already scarce public parking spaces. My sense is that there may have been some misleading advice given on the potential to have private parking in Charbury's center. The solution proposed may be creative, but is certainly not sensitive to the situation.

Mon 24 Nov 2014, 21:14

Why is the length of time living in Charlbury got anything to to with the issue of parking in the town ? Large family homes will often have large families living in them !.The public transport links are good , but does not allow flexible hours and enough locations that are required to cover many different types of jobs ,does not cover runs to schools etc.. Not everyone works close to stations and need direct links to places of work, be able to transport shopping and baggage. To judge other people's transport needs and requirements is not very fair as there may be very good reasons.
As far as i can recall, if a car is taxed and insured it is allowed on the Public Highway, or do you have a pecking order depending on how long you have lived here ?

Mon 24 Nov 2014, 20:19 (last edited on Mon 24 Nov 2014, 20:51)

I too share concerns about the loss of public parking spaces but Danuta it is good to hear you are looking at alternatives and thank you for responding to the points on this thread.

Mon 24 Nov 2014, 18:35

Dear Ms Gray
I have not lived here long, a mere 6 years, but I do feel that in a town with the obvious parking problems in the centre why on earth you feel it is your god given right for not only you and your partner, but your offspring too to have a car EACH when there are such good public transport links.
It's not a great way to win friends and influence people is it?

Good luck with your move.
Dr M Watts

Mon 24 Nov 2014, 13:45

Some very good reasons have been given as to why this proposal, which would entail the loss of three parking spaces in Market Street, should not be approved, in particular the loss of spaces for people using the pharmacy and the post office. I have registered an objection on the WODC site, accordingly.

Sun 23 Nov 2014, 16:56

Firstly I must apologise for referring to Charlbury as a village. Secondly, Mr and Mrs Fairhurst - we received your letter and have responded directly. To update the forum on our reply - we have asked our architect (who is local to Charlbury) to investigate 2 alternatives to minimize the impact of the planning proposal and also to try and take into account the concerns raised. The alternative ideas will require some investigation by the architect and reference to the Highways agency and the WODC Forestry Officer in relation to avoiding risk to some of the trees in the garden before we can determine if they are possible. However, we will look seriously at all possibilities.

Sat 22 Nov 2014, 13:20 (last edited on Mon 24 Nov 2014, 11:07)

I agree that we cannot afford to lose any on-street parking especially on Market Street. I also think it would be easy to change the application so that no parking places are lost.
As Richard has said I would encourage anyone who has posted or who is concerned about this application to come along to the Town Council meeting on Monday 24th at 7.30 in the corner house where this application will be discussed.
In the near future we will also meet Anthony Kirkwood at the Road Safety Engineering Team at OCC regarding traffic control measures such as the introduction of 20 mph speed limits or other measures. This is a complex issue with cost implications for the Town and it will also be useful to gather opinions on this.

Fri 21 Nov 2014, 21:35 (last edited on Sat 22 Nov 2014, 09:30)

I don't think adding blue lines and boxes to the street would be sympathetic to the conservation zone.

Fri 21 Nov 2014, 13:43

I have commented on the WODC webpage and written to the Town Clerk, as Richard suggests.

Thu 20 Nov 2014, 23:01 (last edited on Thu 20 Nov 2014, 23:03)

How about exploring sharing use of the access lane / driveway to the right of the proposed site (approximately opposite the post office)? I don't know the names of the properties currently served by the driveway.

Thu 20 Nov 2014, 20:06

Regarding the comments from Angus, we must keep the number of possible parking spaces and in reality increase these.
This has a direct link to the issues of the station users and the need for further parking at the station and keeping the available spaces in the town for the residents , not the commuters who are unable to find space. Land needs to be made available, or with the development of the Spendlove site, dig down and provide spaces below ground level. Just an idea as the problem will not go away.

Thu 20 Nov 2014, 19:18 (last edited on Thu 20 Nov 2014, 20:01)

Parking is a real problem in some areas of the town (not "village"!). And I agree 100% with Richard Fairhurst that people who move into new areas should look at all possible problems before buying. As a former teacher I remember only too well complaints from new neighbours of our school about the noise from the playground during playtimes. They had viewed their property during the summer holiday! Charlbury needs every available on-street parking place if the town centre is not to die and some 'short-time' bays would be an excellent idea.

Thu 20 Nov 2014, 17:48

Usually all the spaces outside the Chemist are full as I found one hour ago when I drove to the Chemist. The loss of one/two spaces would cause real hardship to Charlbury residents. Albeit admirable that someone is taking on the restoration of Allbright House butI would suggest that it is not a suitable property for a four car family. There must be more suitable locations.

Thu 20 Nov 2014, 14:49

Dear Mr Fairhurst, I can assure you we are trying to be respectful to the village, the house and it's heritage, our prospective neighbours and other activities in the village in the plans to renovate the Albright House and the Malt house and address the challenge of parking. Unfortunately we can not simply rely on public transport for a variety of reasons. We will speak to our architect to ensure the intention for this proposal to impact on just one space is in fact the reality. Yours Danuta Gray

Thu 20 Nov 2014, 14:05

The space proposed for the dropped kerb into the driveway is 7m. Taking the length of our car as an example (3.5m), that's two car-lengths.

The remaining space between the end of the dropped kerb and the start of the existing double yellow lines across Chelwood's driveway is 2.2m. OCC will not permit parking in such a limited space.

The total take is therefore 9.2m. This isn't a loss of one space, it's a loss of two generous spaces and (given the length of space remaining outside the Pharmacy) is likely to often mean three in practice.

For those of us lucky enough to live in central Charlbury, we need to cut our cloth to suit the environment of this historic town, and to be respectful of the other activities that go on - shopping, Corner House events, and so on. After we moved from Nine Acres Close to Market Street, we downsized from two medium-size cars to one small car, and use train/bus/bike for other journeys.

Adding three extra cars to the town centre and then "privatising" three spaces, so that they are never available for public use, is not respectful. It's comparable to moving in and complaining about the church bells and I'm very disappointed to see it happening.

Thu 20 Nov 2014, 13:11 (last edited on Thu 20 Nov 2014, 13:13)

Um...not ideal really, but I can see it from both sides (as a resident of Market Street too). My main concern - (over and above the fact that unloading the car with kids/shopping etc already is a nightmare, notwithstanding losing another parking space here) - is for the elderly accessing both the pharmacy and the PO - my Mother being one of those. A compromise might be this: in France where we go each year the Medieval town deals with a similar parking nightmare very well, by providing 10 Minute only parking spaces, that are designated in BLUE. I would propose 2/or 3 or these outside the chemist, over and above the disabled one outside Tim's shop. Overall though...us residents of Market Street are unfortunately the folks who constantly play Russian Roulette when it comes to parking, and so, it seems, it continues!

Thu 20 Nov 2014, 13:06 (last edited on Thu 20 Nov 2014, 13:11)

Thu 20 Nov 2014, 11:54

Dear Mr Walker. The previous owners of Albright parked on street and yes we would be parking on street now with 3 cars soon to be 4. So the net result works. We are not yet resident simply due to the amount of work to be done before we move in. But we have already had issues parking outside the house on our frequent visits hence our proposal. Regards Danuta Gray

Thu 20 Nov 2014, 11:32

Thank you for the explanation, Danuta, but I am not sure that the maths adds up. One public space goes in Market Street, but the three or four cars you say will be removed from on-street parking are not necessarily there yet, or are they? If they are, and your family has that number of cars already parked in Church street then your suggestion is right, but if they - or some of them - still have to arrive, then I don't think that you can count prospective parking in your total.

Thu 20 Nov 2014, 11:18

Dear All - I thought it might be helpful to reply here and clarify a couple of points and we will, of course write to any who write to us directly. My husband and I are the applicants. Our planning is aimed at removing the need for on street parking overall although we are looking to use our archway to park one car from the Church Street side. The planning application does not make it obvious but the proposal removes one space from Market Street and takes 3/4 cars off road for parking so for the combination of Church Street and Market Street is a net gain. We have 2 teenage boys who are learning to drive and we would prefer to have the space to remove their cars from parking on the road rather than need to find space to park outside the house or elsewhere on the surrounding streets. The yew tree is protected and is to be retained - we have no intention or desire to lose it. Regards Danuta Gray

Thu 20 Nov 2014, 10:21

Have sent objection.
Also the Yew tree on the corner of that site is a listed tree which might affect the actual position of an entrance.

Thu 20 Nov 2014, 10:12

Register at westoxon.gov.uk and sign up for notices of all planning applications within 500m of where you live. Then you won't be taken by surprise. You get notice of bin collections too. Click 'register' top right of the page.

This application would put another nail in the coffin of the town centre.

Thu 20 Nov 2014, 09:57

At present the space between the Pharmacy and Post Office accommodates four or five cars.

This proposed new entrance would remove three of these public spaces, in order to provide access to three private spaces in the Malthouse garden.

As Pearl says, the spaces are regularly used by shoppers at the Pharmacy (in particular) as well as the Post Office, Cotswold Frames, and barbers. Overnight they are used by Market Street residents (disclaimer - I'm one) and by people attending events in the Corner House.

With 14 off-road 'yard' spaces being removed to make way for a new development, the removal of a space further down the road to provide driveway access, the anticipated removal of spaces when Britannic Engineering is converted to residential, and the pressure from the station car park (already full again), Market Street parking is already under enough pressure.

I have written to the applicants suggesting they might like to revise their application so the on-road spaces are kept. (There is a fairly obvious solution!)

You can make a comment on the application at the WODC website using the link Simon gave - publicaccess.westoxon.gov.uk/online-applications/applicationDetails.do?activeTab=summary&keyVal=NE21LURKFPD00 - and click 'Make a comment' on the right.

You might also like to note that Charlbury Town Council's planning meeting is on Monday (24th). The Town Council does not decide on planning applications, the District Council does, but it's helpful for the Town Council to hear residents' opinions when formulating its own response. So do email the Town Clerk, charlburytc@btinternet.com, as well as making a comment on the District Council website.

Thu 20 Nov 2014, 08:46

Oh sorry - just noticed this after posting my own thing about it.

Wed 19 Nov 2014, 20:55 (last edited on Wed 19 Nov 2014, 21:00)

I just had a look at that Elaine, you're right where are we going park especially when we have parcels too heavy to carry them from Co-op car park, or stop close by Chemist when we need our prescriptions etc.as some people are not able walk down, or visit Cotswold Frames for our gifts and so on.
Oh dear that does not sound good.

Wed 19 Nov 2014, 19:15 (last edited on Wed 19 Nov 2014, 21:24)

14/01589/HHD | Erection of link extension between Albright House and The Malthouse to form single dwelling. New vehicular access from Market Street - (no parking spaces for the Post Office, Cotwolds Frames, Library, Chemist cafe etc ) | Albright House Church Street Charlbury Chipping Norton Oxfordshire OX7 3PR consultation ends on the 9th December (Applicaton validation date was 26th Oct) Full details on the WODC web site where you can give comments ! I found out by chance and not from WODC.