Driving at 20mph (Debate)

Tue 28 Nov 2023, 09:05

Hawkwind's Silver Machine may be even more appropriate.

Tue 28 Nov 2023, 06:41

Try crossing at the lower end of Hixet Wood.  From Five Ways to Wellington Cottages.  Many is the time I've narrowly escaped injury, or worse.

There is no sight line, and quiet Armoured Personnel Vehicles, are a menace.

Mon 27 Nov 2023, 21:26

My LEAF hums under 20 mph, but people often don't seem to notice it. It would be more effective if it blasted out  Thunderstruck by ACDC.

Mon 27 Nov 2023, 18:24 (last edited on Mon 27 Nov 2023, 18:40)

Good news. New EV's are required to do this. For example our Renault Zoë gives off a melodic hum under when travelling at under 30kph.

The change was developed by the EU following a consultation in 2017 and agreed in a "delegated direction" in March 2019. It is part of a much wider package of proposals to improve road safety which  will be developed up to 2030.  

https://single-market-economy.ec.europa.eu/news/electric-and-hybrid-cars-new-rules-noise-emitting-protect-vulnerable-road-users-2019-07-03_en

The delegated regulation took place before the end of the transition period and so the UK has also adopted this.

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/new-noise-systems-to-stop-silent-electric-cars-and-improve-safety

Sat 25 Nov 2023, 20:49

I think EVs need some kind of bicycle bell or old - fashioned hooter so they can politely let pedestrians know they are coming. The other day I had to wind down my window and shout "excuse me!" to a nice gentleman who was walking in the middle of a single track road with his back to me. 

Sat 25 Nov 2023, 15:41 (last edited on Sat 25 Nov 2023, 15:50)

Look up the concept of "Power Band" ie revs per minute (RPM) of an internal combustion piston engine (petrol/spark ignition and diesel/compression ignition). The effects are the same. Working by gearing appropriately  within the power band revs = a more or less more efficient burn, less pollutants uncombusted, and not as much extra fuel consumption as you might think.

The battery electric traction vehicle means vastly less local air pollution. Surely a boon. But as Harriet points out, audible warnings of electric vehicles are really low - all one hears is tyre noise and possibly a small drive-train "whine" from the electric motor and any reduction gears.

I've been nearly caught stepping into the road by the Coop - twice! - be electric SUVs I didn't hear. And my hearing is not compromised like Harriet's. Oh, and by the way, the ultra-expensive Chelsea Commando vehicles were moving far too fast for the conditions...

Sat 25 Nov 2023, 15:39

Mark, we have just been through the town centre and found exactly the same. I think, unfortunately, we have become a bit of a tourist destination and this is now how it’s going to be.  People walking around, either photographing everything or as we have just seen, a lady walking along making a video, to be appearing soon on TikTok.

Sat 25 Nov 2023, 13:18 (last edited on Sat 25 Nov 2023, 14:29)

The introduction and expense of signs showing the new speed limits . I noticed today that the centre of Charlbury was exceptionally busy and lots of cars parking on yellow lines, in disabled spaces and blocking entrances - all without Wilderness , and not one of them a Range Rover ! Is there an event taking place today ??? The ability to  to exceed the 20 mph zones created , was impossible when 30 mph was the limit to the narrow road network in the centre of town , and has had little benefit, and created signs and signposts detracting from lovely stone buildings and very restrictive planning conditions to the properties that have signage placed in front of them ! 

Fri 24 Nov 2023, 07:07

Don’t mention establishments turning parking spaces into increased dining spaces, Mark. That really gets them riled up.

Thu 23 Nov 2023, 15:48 (last edited on Thu 23 Nov 2023, 17:42)

I've quickly got used to the 20mph Charlbury speed limits. I'm currently in a town in France where you see lots of tree/shrub planting alongside widened pavements, alongside new cycle lanes. Speed limit is 30 kph.

This makes for much more pleasant walking and more pavement space for less abled people. Coffee shops now have tables on a pavement which a few years ago was parking for a single vehicle.

There are fewer traffic jams (compared with previously) and the air is a bit cleaner. There are noticeably fewer SUVs here too, partly because many of the roads here are in a ULEZ, and partly because smaller, less polluting cars seem to be both cheaper and more available.

ps - just looked up a published audit of impact of environmental improvements on one (long) street near us: average daily noise levels down 5db, air quality up 12%, 1,000m2 green space created, 160 new trees planted...

Thu 23 Nov 2023, 10:50

Not only the flashy cars, a number of older, louder ones, also have issues with faulty speedometers 😂

Thu 23 Nov 2023, 07:54

Maximum 20 is more like second gear! Whilst the average speed has certainly dropped there are still a significant fraction far exceeding this, particularly with the increase in flashy cars and Chelsea tractors visiting our town.

Thu 23 Nov 2023, 07:26 (last edited on Thu 23 Nov 2023, 08:18)

Simon, unfortunately the police seem to have ceased speeding enforcement entirely.  (I once wrote about it to the useless “police and crime commissioner”, but it seems that his £95,000 salary entitles him not to bother answering correspondence.  Maybe he got it from Robert Courts?)

Thu 23 Nov 2023, 05:40

Unfortunately, those people who used to speed when it was a 30 still speed in a 20.  Not really sure why people think making it a 20 would change this. There needs to be enforcement to encourage people to comply. Otherwise, it is a complete waste of money.  

Wed 22 Nov 2023, 13:53

I am totally adjusted to driving at 20 - not seen queues as a result. One observation: people are still driving a lot faster than 20 down the hill on the slade (just after the dancers hill turn) - and the warning sign seems to have been turned off there.

Wed 22 Nov 2023, 12:25 (last edited on Wed 22 Nov 2023, 12:31)

Harriet, like any sensible driver I always drive at such a speed that I can stop within my sight-lines .. something that became second nature when I rode a motorbike.  Nevertheless I'm a bit alarmed by your habit of "walking in the middle of the road on corners".

I'm sorry you think I should drive a noisier, smellier car (and faster); but you seem to be in a minority!

Wed 22 Nov 2023, 08:07 (last edited on Wed 22 Nov 2023, 08:08)

I enjoy not having to worry about gears.  There are no queues of traffic, just safer roads.

(Interesting to see that the latest definition of being thoughtful about others includes thinking about vulnerable road users)

Wed 22 Nov 2023, 08:06

John your car is probably one of those ones I can't hear because it doesn't make a proper engine sound? Hopefully the 20mph will give you time to stop if you come round a corner and I'm in the middle of the road. 

Tue 21 Nov 2023, 22:19

Liz, to answer your question - sadly No! third gear = higher revs = higher fuel burn = more pollution/mile = less time looking outside the office rather than outside for hazard. Moreover, the present signage is both confusing and inconsistent; it merely adds to the stress level. If every built-up and street lamp - lit area goes 20 mph so be it, particularly, if traffic calming methods are also present. However, the present "knee jerk" vote-catching reaction of the (apparently cash-strapped) woke authorities just clouds the issue. No doubt, eventually both our behaviour and economy will succumb - I just wonder but at what cost? - hopefully, I won't be driving by then.

Tue 21 Nov 2023, 19:50

Oh dear:  where are these queues?  Like Liz I'm enjoying it both as a driver and pedestrian.  At least my car, which is charged by the sun, isn't harming you, Harriet.

Only today I saw a black cat step blithely out into the Slade (is that lucky or unlucky .. for me I mean, not the cat?) right in front of an appropriately-slow car which managed to stop without difficulty.

Tue 21 Nov 2023, 19:27

I find the resulting queues of traffic make it far more difficult to breathe and am having to use an inhaler on a regular basis, whereas before I'd only have issues with traffic fumes in foggy conditions

Tue 21 Nov 2023, 18:11

Does anyone else feel the pleasure of driving in third gear, relaxing, even stately?